Fanni Gambero on Using Personality Assessments in the Interview Process

Fanni · 0:00

Hi, my name is Fanni Gambero, and today's leadership quote comes from my friend Fletcher Wimbush. There is no shortage of talent out there, but a shortage of effective hiring processes. And I added a little blurb at the end of this quote myself. I think there's a shortage of leaders who know what to do with untamed talent.

Speaker 3 · 0:28

The Leader Assistant Podcast exists to encourage and challenge assistants to become confident, game-changing leader assistants.

Jeremy · 0:44

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Fanni · 1:52

Hi Jeremy. Hi everybody. It's so nice to be here.

Jeremy · 1:56

Love it. What part of the world are you in?

Fanni · 2:00

Right now, I am in Haslett, Texas, which is right in between Dallas and Fort Worth.

Jeremy · 2:06

Awesome. Then where are you from originally?

Fanni · 2:09

I'm originally from Hungary, and I'm actually traveling very soon back home, so I'm excited to be visiting family.

Jeremy · 2:17

Oh, cool, cool. And what brought you to the US?

Fanni · 2:22

Yeah, so I actually met my husband on a mission trip when I was 18, and I was a translator at the Bible Camp that we attended, and we kept in touch. We did long distance for about three years when I was 20, not even 20. Yeah, I was 21. He proposed and we got married in Hungary, but then we moved to South Korea to kind of see the world for two years. We love traveling. And then he is from the US. So after that two-year endeavor, we decided to move to the US in 2014. So I've been here since then, and I'm an American citizen now.

Jeremy · 3:03

Oh, awesome. Congrats.

Fanni · 3:05

Thanks.

Jeremy · 3:06

That's great. So how did you end up becoming an assistant?

Fanni · 3:12

You know, it's kind of funny. Whenever I listen to your show, I hear everybody say, oh, I just kind of fell into it, and that's kind of the same thing for me. So one of my friends and I were playing tabletop games, and I was complaining to her about my current job, where the leader was just a terrible leader. He's not listening. But he was just not a great leader. And she said that, hey, I work with a lot of small businesses. Why don't we have coffee and kind of just see what you want to do? I really didn't know what I wanted to do, but I knew it was going to be in the business world. And then we had that coffee. I was definitely late because I didn't take the right exit, but we had coffee. And then she was very gracious, just asked me, she asked me a lot of questions. And I did not know that they were actually hiring for an office admin position. But it seemed like whatever I was searching for and looking for was what they wanted. And yeah, in 2018, I got hired at XM Performance, which is a coaching consulting training company in South Lake, Texas. And yeah, that was almost six years ago. My sixth anniversary is soon coming up, so.

Jeremy · 4:35

Wow. So how has your role evolved over those six years?

Fanni · 4:43

Wow. It's evolved quite a lot. As I said, I didn't really know what I wanted to do in the business world. So we kind of just put me in the office admin role where I had to learn like everything about the business and kind of manage events and stuff like that. But after about two months, I earned the title office manager. Right. And then whenever I actually was pregnant when I got hired, they didn't know, but I tricked them. Ross always jokes about that. I tricked them and deceived them. And then after my first maternity leave, we were trying to figure out where do my strengths really lie? And I really loved serving and I loved figuring out processes and systems and kind of just being Jack of all trades, Jill of all trades, and I became the president's executive assistant. And I did that for about a year, year and a half, and that was super fun. And that's when I actually got introduced to The Leader Assistant Podcast. That's when I first started listening to it. And I remember, I think you had probably 60 episodes out at that point. And I scrolled down to the bottom all the way. And I started listening from Episode 1.

Jeremy · 6:06

Nice.

Fanni · 6:07

And I just absorb all of the information because I've never been an executive assistant before in the past. And so I wanted to be the best or at least serve my executive real well. And so that was one of the catalysts for me to really enjoy and dive into this world of assisting.

Jeremy · 6:28

Nice. So then, what's, I'm trying to figure out your story, and this is why I wanted to talk with you. So you're now the president and co-founder of XM Talent Pros. So you're technically not an assistant anymore, is that correct?

Fanni · 6:44

Yeah, that's correct. So thank you. I know my story, as I said, it's a long journey, and there has been a lot of iterations of what Fanni is doing at XM Performance. So, yeah, so I became the president's EA, and I did that for about a year and a half. And actually, my friend who recruited me to the business, left the business, exited the business. So I took on the role of chief of staff at the time. So making sure, of course, all projects are moving forward and the team is kind of aligned, and rowing in the same boat based on the president's vision. And then our business revolves around helping small to mid-sized businesses become the best places to work in America. And so we work with a lot of small businesses, and we help them grow their business and have strategic clarity. And we had, I attended a lot of mastermind groups, and we just kept hearing from our clients that they needed Fanni, in their business, they needed a small business accelerator, what we call it, in their business. And a lot of our clients kept asking us, you know, hey, how do I find somebody like Fanni or somebody who can help me with my calendar and email management? And, you know, at first, we just said, you know, like, engage some recruiters. But after some time, we said, well, we can actually help you find a person like that or a person that you need. And so about, yeah, three years ago, we started experimenting with the process of recruiting into small businesses. And now we are actually expanding our brand. So I get to work with my executive on co-founding this business called XM Talent Pros, which is our recruiting side of our business. I don't like to call it recruiting because we're more like casting directors to find the co-star roles for small businesses.

Jeremy · 8:51

Yeah, I like that.

Fanni · 8:53

Because we know, yeah, we know admins are co-stars, definitely, in small businesses and in any business, too. You know, any EA is the co-star.

Jeremy · 9:04

Yeah. So, XM Talent Pros is essentially, are you focused on the executive assistant slash president or CEO partnership and helping executives find assistance? Is that what you're focused on?

Fanni · 9:21

Yeah, that's exactly it. Okay. That's exactly it. I just focus on the small business community because that's where our heart is. I'm familiar with the small business community. And I know, yes, of course, every president and CEO needs somebody different, but especially in small business, you have to have a person who can cover and learn a lot of areas of the business, right? And so we do a consultative session with the presidents that we talk to about who they are, who do they need, where are their blind spots. We help attract talent into their business based on our process. We do the interviewing for them, the first round of interviewing, and then ultimately it's their decision who they pick. But then after that, we stay on board and we help coach the entrepreneur and the new Small Business Accelerator, or EA, how to learn about each other faster. So we leverage personality assessments in that process.

Jeremy · 10:31

Nice. So what would you say is the prime profile, if you will, of a casting director or of a small business accelerator? A slash assistant.

Fanni · 10:51

Yeah. So that is a great question, Jeremy. I would say that there isn't really one. However, the way we look at it is what we learned is, for example, Ross and I are completely different personalities. We use disk and 12 driving forces and we've taken other personality assessments as well, but those two are our favorites. And Ross is the typical entrepreneur, high D personality, he shoes before he aims type person, right? And I, on the other hand, I'm a little bit more reserved and I like to take a step back before I act. So we really are completely different personalities, and that's what comes in handy in an EA entrepreneur partnership, we feel like. However, EAs have to be very detail-oriented. You know, we don't want to have little things fall through the cracks. We have to come up with our own systems and processes. We kind of have to get fired up about that. So I would say, you know, my preference is always either an SC or DC for an EA on the Dysprofile if you guys are familiar with that.

Jeremy · 12:11

Could you share like a short version of what that means? Like what the D and the SC? It's been a long time since I've done it.

Fanni · 12:18

It's been a long time. Yeah, definitely. So D, I, S, and C, they all stand for something. So D stands for dominance. I is influence. S is steadiness. And C is compliance. So imagine a high D personality as a lion in the animal world. You can't tell them what to do. They always go after their own prey. And, you know, again, there's no rules for them, right? High I is like an otter in the animal world. So they're very social, outgoing, just fun, you know, cute creatures. And then high S is like a golden retriever. So what characterizes a golden retriever? They're very mellow, loyal. The environment is very steady. That's what they prefer, right? And a high C personality is like a beaver. Beavers build dams and they follow processes and systems, right? So a high C personality is driven to follow the rules and regulations set by others, right? So that's your crash course on the DISS profile. And, you know, interesting differences between the D's. So if you pair them up, so D's and I's on the DISS profile are very fast paced individuals. C's and S's are, on the other hand, they're slower paced. Doesn't mean they're slow completely or, you know, slow pokes and slow moving, but they're thorough, right? So they like to take their time to make sure the output or whatever project they're working on is done correctly. Now, if we pair the other ones, so D's and C's are task oriented, S's and I's are people oriented. So high I, high S will come in to work, and the first thing they'll talk about is what they did in the weekend, you know, what recipes they tried and kind of just have this personal connection that's really important for them. And then D's and C's will say, okay, hey, how's it going? What are the projects we got to get done today? So, you know, that's something that can create conflict between people, but also in an EA Entrepreneur Partnership, you know, when Ross gets excited about a chaotic environment, while I, on the other hand, like to bring the steadiness, the peace, the harmony, right? So we can cover each other's blind spots in that way. And so to answer your original question, Jeremy, I think the best profile for an EA Entrepreneur is the profile that complements each other, kind of like a puzzle piece, right? So opposites are great when it comes to. Because I did hire a high I, or I did place a high I small business accelerator with an entrepreneur who is not that outgoing, but he knew that for his business, he had to be the salesperson and go to networking events and kind of just be social. So we decided to hire a higher I, a very outgoing social personality as his EA. And she was the one who would work the crowd and just bring the right connections to him. So that was, that was kind of a different approach. Yeah.

Jeremy · 15:39

That's awesome. So what then, when you do these assessments and you try to pair, what are some other things you do in the interview process? So let's say this executive scores high on the on the D and then the assistant scores high on the S and you're like, oh, this on paper, this looks good. How do you filter via your conversations on interviews? What maybe what kind of questions do you ask? What kind of red flags do you look for? Because I'm sure there are times when on paper it looks like a good match, but then you talk to them and it's like, yeah, this isn't going to work.

Fanni · 16:20

Absolutely. I love the question as well. And I love sharing my favorite interview questions with people. First and foremost, I focus on character skills because that's something you cannot teach. If somebody does not have the right attitude, it's not something you can inspire them to have a better attitude. There's no way. So a couple of things that I ask are, what's the best place you've ever worked at, and why you loved it, and what's the worst? And then what I'm listening for is, how do they present that negative answer? Are they telling me that, oh my goodness, this was the most terrible job I've ever had, and I'm never going to go back there? Then what I'm hearing is, this person has kind of a victim mindset and I'm not looking for that. I'm looking for a person who wants to grow and has learned from that situation. Yeah, this situation or this work environment was not the one that fit me personally. I am definitely looking for something else, but I learned a lot about what to look for in my next job or something like that, right? So those are the things I'm looking for. I'm also looking for if they're showing up on time. How do they present themselves, their communication skills? What other questions do we ask? Tell me about the best boss you've ever had and why you enjoyed working with them. So we're looking for what type of leader they've had experience working with and what did they enjoy about that personality or what was challenging. Of course, I ask about their future dreams. That's how we can be casting directors at XM Talent Pros. Basically, where the company is going, because I know where the company is going, that's part of my conversation with my clients. If the direction the company is going doesn't align with the vision of the EA, it's not going to be a long-term match, not going to be a long-term engagement. So I want to see if this, a lot of people during interviews say, I'm looking for growth. I usually pause them and say, what does that really mean for you? Do you want to gain more new skills or growth as in a different status in the company or lead people? What does that really mean for you? And can the company, and sometimes small businesses are limited as far as growth opportunities, sometimes not always, right? But can the company really give that to the candidate? And that's what I'm focusing on if there's an alignment there as well, not just short-term but long-term too.

Speaker 2 · 19:22

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Jeremy · 19:59

That's great. Super, super helpful tips. Thank you so much for sharing. Let's take a step back for a second and share with us a little bit about your vision on, you know, what you want to help assistance with in general and, you know, big picture grand scheme of things. How do you want to impact the administrative profession with the work that you guys are doing?

Fanni · 20:28

Yeah. And it's, it's really amplifying what you're already doing, honestly. And other bigger names in our community do, like Hallie Warner with The Force Multiplier and, and other, other individuals who are helping the admin community. My vision, you know, one thing I realized about being a small business EA or a small business accelerator is, we're usually alone and we're the only person in our company, and we don't have a community to turn to. So we actually had a networking event that we did for a year in person in the Dallas area for small business accelerators or admins. So we got together for a lunch and learn once a month, and we had a speaker come in or I, I had the topic I covered. And we just shared a meal together and talked about, you know, the frustrating things about being an EA or the challenging things and all the, all the great parts as well. So I'd love to just connect with a lot of small business admins who are hoping to take their career to the next level, just like you, Jeremy. But also if somebody is growing in a company and they need to find their replacement, I can teach them how to find that person or I can take that off their plate as well. So that would be, that would be a great collaboration, I think. And also, I never knew that I was going to be somebody who hires people for a living. I didn't know I was going to do business consulting. I just learned all that by shadowing my executive.

Jeremy · 22:28

Right.

Fanni · 22:29

And having him pour into me as an individual was huge. And so I want to find businesses like that, where the leaders pour into their employees, especially their admin as well. I want to find businesses like that so I can bring the right administrator to them so they can even double their business or triple their business in a short amount of time, and also benefit personally and professionally from this partnership.

Jeremy · 23:08

That's great. Sounds like a good mission to me.

Fanni · 23:13

I know we're aligned on that.

Jeremy · 23:17

That's awesome. Well, what's maybe another kind of final word for assistants out there, but specifically, I know a lot of assistants are currently looking for work. Maybe they were laid off for whatever reason or another. And what would be your encouragement to the unemployed assistants listening right now?

Fanni · 23:41

Yeah, absolutely. It is tough to be in a position like that. But I think the best thing is to network and ask around your friends, your family, if they have any connections. So I think the easiest way to land a job is through your network. My most recent projects were for remote EA positions, and we received about a thousand candidates. So your resume really has to shine for me to see that you're that servant-hearted and go-getter individual, right? It's really hard to communicate that on paper, right? So sometimes the easiest way to find somebody is through our network. And also, read the job description from top to bottom. One of our secret sauces, I'll tell you, the way we find assistants is we give them a lot of tasks to do, to edit their resume or cover letter in a certain way. And we overlook those people. We actually don't even consider those people that don't follow the instructions because we know that admins have to be detail-oriented. So truly read every word that the job description say, because there might be other companies I know utilize this strategy. So there might be something like that. And it's just an easy task, but that's their first line of figuring out who's going to come in that role next. And then again, I don't have a lot of experience with corporations. If you have some friends or any people that you are connected with on LinkedIn, connect with them because I know in corporate environment, they have an applicant tracking system or a system that the company built where current employees can invite candidates. And that's how the resumes get noticed or placed on the top. Yeah, exactly. So that could be a good tip. Hopefully, that's helpful.

Jeremy · 26:06

Yeah. No, I 100% agree. I think that nowadays it's even more important to network and have somebody on the inside, put your name at the top of the list or make sure you get a call back. So I definitely agree with you there.

Fanni · 26:24

Yeah.

Jeremy · 26:25

Well, Fanni, thank you so much for your time. This has been great, fun conversation. I do have one last fun, quick question. What is your favorite thing to do when you're not working?

Fanni · 26:38

What's my favorite thing to do when I'm not working? Of course, hanging out with my kiddos and my husband, I love that, but escape rooms are something that I really enjoy doing. I love figuring out puzzles and just the thrill of, oh, are we going to get out or not? It's super fun.

Jeremy · 26:55

Nice. Awesome. Well, thanks again. Is there a good place, one-stop shop and I'll put all your links in the show notes as well, but is there a one-stop shop that people can reach out and say hi if they want to connect?

Fanni · 27:08

Yeah, Jeremy, it would be my LinkedIn profile, so connect with me on LinkedIn. The link is going to be in the show notes, but if you visit xmtalentpros.com, definitely sign up for our newsletter. I can't wait to share our message with more people. If you know any admins and smaller businesses that don't have the support that they feel like they need or would want, or whoever is looking for jobs, feel free to connect me with them on LinkedIn as well.

Jeremy · 27:44

Sounds great. We'll definitely do that. And again, the show notes are at leaderassistant.com/284, leaderassistant.com/284 to find out more about Fanni and her business and reach out and connect and say hi. So thanks again for being on the show. Thanks for being a listener of the show. I don't know. You said you started back at one. I don't know if you're all caught up or are you in the hundreds?

Fanni · 28:12

I'm not. I've had two kids in the middle. Even though my drive time is quite a commute, it's 40 minutes there and then 40 minutes back. But yet the most recent episodes I feel I'm caught up on.

Jeremy · 28:28

Nice. Well, you'll have to start listening to them. If you don't already, you'll have to start listening to them at 2x speed, which my voice is more interesting at 2x speed anyway.

Fanni · 28:39

So I should try that.

Jeremy · 28:40

I should get through a lot more episodes that way.

Speaker 3 · 28:42

I know. Yeah.

Fanni · 28:43

Thank you. Thank you, Jeremy, for having me on the podcast. This was super fun. Thanks for all you do for the admin community.

Jeremy · 28:52

Yeah, you're welcome. My pleasure. We'll talk soon.

Fanni · 28:55

All right.

Speaker 3 · 28:55

See you. Please review on Apple Podcasts.

Speaker 2 · 29:15

goburrows.com.